If the number of players who want less non-consensual PvP is larger that the number who want more, what does that suggest to you?

What CCP wants is a profitable game. They don't seem to realize they have been shooting themselves in the foot on a regular basis while trying to get there.

If the number of players who want less non-consensual PvP is larger that the number who want more, what does that suggest to you?

The 'hard-core' players don't seem to have any problem telling the less hard-core to quit whining. If the majority of the players didn't mind getting involved in the forum flame wars so they could have their say, who would be the whiners then?

Every issue has two sides, or it probably wouldn't be an issue. The current societal paradigm seems to be "Do what does the most good for the most people", as a guideline to make decisions about issues.

It appears to me that the hard-core players are a special interest group trying to dominate the discussion by making the loudest noises.

Not if they beat up the guy who keeps pointing it out.

I think that CCP would disagree with this.

You must not have been around for the Incarna Disaster. :)

EVEs' PCU record for Tranquility it's 63k users online, and that was right before Incarna. Retribution's record is on 57k, which was the record in 2010.

Albeit CCP may be enjoying more subscriptions than ever after relaunching the Chinese server (Serenity), the fact is that Tranquility has been slowboating on the verge of stalling after recovering from the Incarna drops. And that has come at a high price in marketing efforts to draw in returning customers and improve the initial retention of new players. More effort to stay in place is always the precursor of negative growth AKA going to hell.

You must not have been around for the Incarna Disaster. :)

The point that I'm trying to make is that, if they can't even return to previous levels of users on line, where are they going?

If they want to make this a total niche game, that's their prerogative, but is that good for either them or the player community?

I really don't want to quit this game, even though it has become a major disappointment, and I am preparing to shut down the 4th of my 5 accounts.

You're are missing the point. Eve nearly died after Incarna. Is that what you want to see happen again? Eve isn't growing. It's stagnant. Spend a few minutes on line each day and you will see that.

So you are saying that, when there are six people still paying for the game, all goonies, trying frantically to bump each other to death in their pods, your dreams will be fulfilled?

I don't think that is going to happen, for a lot of reasons.

I think you need to read a little more about the Incarna Disaster. It had nothing to do with the majority of the players. The Solo players.

Totally wrong. You just don't see the big picture, do you?

First off, I don't think I have ever said, anywhere, that all non-consensual PvP should be taken out of the game. If i did, sorry. Cutting all non-consensual PvP wouldn't solve the problem. (It would be interesting to see what it would do, though.

Returning to the theme of the thread, IMHO, the current game mechanics seem to me to attract players who are not player friendly. For instance, I travel a lot and watch local chat. I may go months before I see any one say or do anything friendly. The majority of what is posted in those channels isn't even civil. No. I'm not advocating that the chat channels be moderated.

But look at the chat channels from a new player's view, or even an experienced solo player. If they don't watch the Forums, and most people don't, the chat channels are probably where people get an idea of what the game is really about, and who is in it with them. So ask yourself when was the last time you saw something in a local chat channel that made you want to join a group for something?

The problem isn't the chat channels, or non-consensual PvP, or a lot of other things. It appears to me that the problem is the mindset of the vocal minority of the players. Scamming, ganking, griefing and piracy aren't for everyone. If that is what you do, then you need to realize that you may have trouble finding people who want to quit soloing, and do it with you.

I should leave your post alone. It speaks volumes about you, but . . .

I've lost more than a hundred ships. One of my characters may have the worst killboard record in the game. So far that hasn't made me quit all the way.

But you need to realize that I don't pay cash for PLEXes to buy my ships with. Each one of those ships represents hours of effort that I have put into the game to earn ISK. Yes, ISK is play money, but the effort involved in earning it is little different from the effort involved in making real money. The office is just in a much worse neighborhood. :)

How do you think that is going to decrease the number of solo players?

(usual l33t PvP bitching-bragging about how EVE is too safe).

High Sec already exists.

Kidding aside, The whole game is a place where people can and do fail (I know i do, like the time i auto piloted an empty frieghter to jita and went to sleep......

.....without bother to check if my alliance at the time was war-decced.......

But a game that calls itself hardcore should never promote failure. Failure in eve comes at a steep cost, and that's part of what makes EVE great. It's sad that some people don't accept that.

The problem is that a failure early on drives a lot of people away. Suppose you have a Trial Account and you are doing tutorials, and you get your first real frigate. You undock and have an instance of non-consensual PvP.

People who complain about other people, who play their own game on the same server you use, are also idiots.

As usual, you left out another important part: if you burn my house, I will kill you so you don't have any chance to burn it again.

Except if they were worth 50% or 100% more than I would have to consider mining them. I mine in high sec. 20% more isn't enough to make me leave for lowsec. or nullsec. The increase in profit has to outweigh the risk of loss, or else it is not worth doing.

I take it you don't do anything in high sec except grief people? If you took a minute to understand why people stay in high sec you could understand what it would take to draw us out.

Also, I do have an alt to suicide gank miners. Not because it is fun, but because killing someone else mining in my belt and having that ore to myself outweighs the cost of losing that ship.

Are you talking about a RL killboard? Don't fool yourself.

the lurking single players who are already subscribed, are the majority of characters on Tranquility.